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Krishna Seva Krishna seva sada kariya(Always serve Lord Krishna)
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Jai jai shri gokulesh
Thank you for the kind words......... And also for appreciating the article. _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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Trushna CEO
Joined: 10 Nov 2005 Posts: 112 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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Thanx Unnatiji I also appreciate this article, your explanation of the different bhavs make sense, but sorry i've got a bit confused....Pushtidasji could you elaborate on what you mean by bhav and love being different? aren't they interlocking and connected? for example,you say that there is a fine line between parental bhav and parental love? but i thought that by having parental bhav for Thakorji you are also loving Him in that way? sorry
Unnatiji im also sorry to you aswell as im also confused by the caution...
my understanding of the caution is that it basically states that earthly love is different from loving God and wrong, i quote "earthly conjugality is purely selfish and is undertaken only because it gives pleasure to ones own self".
The reason why im confused is because in my understanding of pushti marg is that we can only understand how to love Thakorji by loving here on the earth...otherwise how will we know what love is?
earthly conjugality i thought was not always selfish...because you can love your partner and serve Thakorji together with your partner within your home on earth? is that not what Mahaprabhuji wanted? im sorry if i've offended anyone by saying the above, but that is my understanding... please correct and educate me if im wrong. _________________ Yadi Shree Gokuladhisho dhrutah sarvatmana rudhayi, tathi kimparambruhi loukikai vedikai rapi
Jai Shree Krishna |
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:41 am Post subject: |
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Jai jai shri gokulesh
Trushnaji, well i think let this be explained by Pushtidasji in his style.
Pushtidasji please solve this query as i dont know what to reply for Trushnaji's query..... _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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Pushtidas Tibari Star
Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 624 Location: United Kindom
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Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Thanks Unnatiji for cornering me, passing the difficult question for me to answer. Like your style Unnatiji, anyway, Trushnaji, I hope to answer your question to your satisfaction.
The reason Unnatiji declined to answer is in two folds. First of all it is bhava and individual bhava cannot be answered by another bhava, and the second reason is the thin line between love and Bhava, you wrote "a fine line" in your posting. I call it a thin line as "fine" is a normal phrase, a typical English, but I wanted to demonstrate that there is deffinately closeness in love and Bhava but a dividing line is that love has to be the index of bhava. This means that love is the feelings which then conforms into the direction of real love that is typed, that is to say that it conforms to the types of different permutations of love, for example, motherly love or love that conjugal the conjugality (Permeshwar maro Pati (husband) che).
So if one's love conform motherly love, then the bhava, which is the next step from love, depicts that kind of love, that is motherly bhava.
Now let's look at the opening statement made by Unnatji in her warning post:
Quote: | Madhurya Bhava is absolutely different from
conjugality of earthly experience. One should not be mistaken for the other. Earthly conjugality is purely selfish and is undertaken only because it gives pleasure to one's own self |
The Earthly conjugality infringes or contravenes the spiritual conjugality. It encroaches on, or rather trespass on the spiritual conjugality. So the line of infringement breaches and becomes non compliance to the selfish motive sometimes the earthly conjugality portraits. In material world, master of house is the man, that is the husband and in alokik only Krishna is the boss. In both cases of the conjugal environments, there is a conflict, hence, the warning. If one can distinguish this grey area and can separate both from each other, then this bhava is the bhava which Gopis bestowed on Shree Krishna, the bhava had Madhuriya in it. This Madhuriya bhava was latter became known as "Premdha Bhakti", a phrase used by Shree Mahaprabhuji when describing the love of gopis and the seva they did for Krishna.
So Madhuriya bhava is the utmost bhava that Vraj bhakta acquired and one's goal can be this bhava. Vraj Svaminiji's did not injudiciously inject this bhava in public, but in private when they saw it prudent, time and venue where Krishna paid full attention to the individuals. So the warning was fair to earthlings as the Kaliyug acts with power and vigour, and it will be injudicious (unwise) to declare this bhava (Madhuriya bhava) and taking this concept, the warning bells are triggered.
But after saying all this, we all know that ultimate Fal is Pushti Fal, that is, to acquire Krishna. So antonyms (discreet) bhava's goal of Tadrushi (ardent) vaishnav's goal is to become one with God, and this is the Uttam-Pushti-fal. And to be with lord at this level, it is Madhuriya Bhava, and this Bhava is always been the goal of Kumarika's (Rushi-rupa gopis) and the boon was granted to them after Katiyayi Vrat, which was the Maharaas as Fal. _________________ Dasa nu das
Pushtidas |
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:44 am Post subject: |
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Jai jai shri gikulesh
Pustidasji, thanx for the excellent explanation........... _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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Trushna CEO
Joined: 10 Nov 2005 Posts: 112 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 2:13 am Post subject: |
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Thanx Pushtidasji, your explanation was satisfactory! thanx unnatiji for inspiring me to ask these questions _________________ Yadi Shree Gokuladhisho dhrutah sarvatmana rudhayi, tathi kimparambruhi loukikai vedikai rapi
Jai Shree Krishna |
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Vasant Punjabi Admin
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Posts: 987 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 1:55 am Post subject: |
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Jai Jai Shri Gokulesh,
There was one Bhagwadia who asked Shri Mahaprabhuji that which Marg (Path) is better Gyan Marg or Karma Marg?
Shri Vallabh replied both are good but Bhakti Marg is the best.
Unnatiji can you name this Bhagwadia?
Now lets take one shlok of Siddhant Muktavali shlok 19
"--------Ubhayostu Kramenaiva Purvoktaiva Phalisyati
Jnanadhiko BHAKTI MARGA Evam Tasmannirupitah -------"
Both the wise (Gyani) and devotees (Bhakta) are entitled for God's service and both will receive its share of fruit but Bhakti Marg (Path of Devotion ) is superior to Path of Knowledge.
Let us understand this more clearly.
The path of Devotion vouchsafes the achievement of the Supreme Self (Par Brahma). Hence it is higher than the Path of Knowledge. Many people in the world put forth that knowledge (GYAN) is the outcome of Devotion (Bhakti) and knowledge provides salvation (Mukti) .
The knowledge of the unity of the soul and the AKSAR BRAHMA and the knowledge that the whole universe is AKSAR BRAHMA Himself, to know like this is knowledge.
If such a knowledge is dawned upon, still the belongingness to the Supreme Self (Par Brahma) is far away, as the Supreme Being is beyond the AKSAR BRAHMA.
(Hence, Worshipper of the AKSAR BRAHMA greatly suffers !)
Shri Krishna in Shrimad Bhagwad Gita has said the following :-
"Those who surrender all their duties to me and by engrossing in Me, seek my refuge, I absolve them without delay of all the sins."
The path of Devotion (BHAKTI) is, therefore superior to the path of Knowledge. _________________ Vasant Punjabi.
"Shri Vallabh Shri Vithal Sukh-kari naa-me nishpap thai nur-nari,
------Nitya Lila nitya nautam shruti na pame par."---- |
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 4:22 am Post subject: |
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Jai Jai Shri Gokulesh,
Vasantji, thanx for such a beautiful explanation.
The name of the Bhagwadia who asked Shri Mahaprabhuji that which Marg (Path) is better Gyan Marg or Karma Marg was Shri Purushottam Joshi. And for this disciple Shri Mahaprabhuji wrote Bhakti Vardhini Granth in the year V.S. 1552. _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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Vasant Punjabi Admin
Joined: 12 Oct 2005 Posts: 987 Location: USA
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Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Jai Shri Gokulesh,
That was quick Unnatiji, Thanks. Some Gita Shloks.
Satatam Kirtayanto Mam Yatantashcha Dhrdavrta
Namasyantashcha Mam Bhaktya Nityayukta Upasate
Always chanting My glories, endeavoring with great determination,
bowing down before Me, these great souls perpetually worship Me with
devotion. - BG 9:1
Man Mana Bhava Mad Bhakto, Mad Yaji Mam Namaskuru,
Mam Evaishyasi Satyam Te, Pratijane Priyosi Me
Always think of Me and become My devotee. Worship Me and offer your
homage unto Me. Thus you will come to Me without fail. I promise you
this because you are My very dear friend. - BG 18:65 - _________________ Vasant Punjabi.
"Shri Vallabh Shri Vithal Sukh-kari naa-me nishpap thai nur-nari,
------Nitya Lila nitya nautam shruti na pame par."---- |
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Fri Jul 28, 2006 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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Jai jai shri gokulesh
Vasantji, that was beautiful shlokas which u explained with refrence to gitaji. Thankyou very much anf if possible please do continue.... _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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gopal Vice President
Joined: 09 Nov 2005 Posts: 237 Location: India
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Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Jai ShriGokulesh
Very very true Vasantbhai and Unnatiji, regarding the Prasang quoted by the vaarta Praasang of Purushottam Joshi of Kheralu,. which he requested to shrimahaprabhuji that which path is great? Gyan marg or Karma marg? So ShriMahaprabhuji explained the Importance of Bhaktimarg, which is shresth of both the 2.. How did shrimahaprabhuji differentiated this Bhaktimarg from Gyanmarg and Karma marg to be Great? _________________ Jai Jai ShriGokulesh Parivaar,
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Sital CEO
Joined: 07 Nov 2005 Posts: 478 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree krishna
It is because the gnan and karma marg relate to the path of law, whereas the bhakti marg is the path of grace?
JSK _________________ Madhurkomalkant padavali namami
Sital |
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unnati CEO
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 Posts: 423 Location: Mumbai India
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Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 7:26 am Post subject: |
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Jai jai shri gokulesh,
The main purpose for which Shri Mahaprabhuji took birth is to establish "Pustimarg". Pusti means Divya anugrah / Divya Krupa. It also means Nourishment i.e.
1) Sharirik => Nourishment for Body.
2) Adhiyatmik => Nourishment for Soul.
Pustimarg is a devine selection or divine election of the devotees by the lord. The reason for why they are been selected is coz they are pure, chaste and simple love. And this what comes above all in pusti. It is love without any motive. Pusti bhakti is a selfless supreme love for god. Love which is Natural and Spontenious. It is a continious flow. It is an end rather then the means. It is an attainment of the supreme god who is bliss and love.
Pushi bhakti is a grace of god. Here both the end and means is god. Everything is god i.e. praman, pramay, sadhan and fal. If one has to meet the god then pusti bhakti is the only meansand not the other 2 paths i.e Pravah Marg and Maryada Marg. But Karma, Gyan and Upasna are the basic step to attain Pusti Bhakti.
In Karma marg one can make happy to god by doing as per said in scripure i.e Vidhi(Do's) and Nished(Don't). Through Gyan Marg as per the intrest of the soul he comes to know wheather it is the true goal or not. And Upasana Marg is a path of worship of the desired deties through Jap, mantra etc. But all this results to attain Akshar Bhrama and not the communion with god.
In Bhagwatji it is said that "Poshanam Tad Anugraha" i.e. If you have the blessings then only one can get Nourishment. 6th Canto of of Bhagwat is known as Pustiskand i.e. of Ajamil. And then at 10th canto, the episode of Vraj swamniji's and Lord Krishna. Shri Mahaprabhuji's Pusti Marg is based on this 2 canto's as they are the base of Pusti Bhakti.
Please feel free to correct.... _________________ Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....Shri Vitthala Nam Vina Mantra Kya Thi Paou......Shri Vallabha Charan Vina Sharan Koni Jaou.....
Unnati M. Kadakia |
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Pushtidas Tibari Star
Joined: 10 Oct 2005 Posts: 624 Location: United Kindom
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Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna
Well said Unnatiji, that is why Shree Mahaprabhuji also gives us that assurance by saying:
Bhagvanpi Pushtistho na karishiyati lokikam cha Gatim |
God is very generious and will bestow his grace which will always be with bhakta so that all ramification and the worldly rankle (continue cause and sentiment and bitterness) of lokik world. And this is only possible when Atma induges in Seva and bhakti. Seva and Bhakti is the best medicine to recuperate, that is to recover from ill-lokik Maya. This Lokik atmosphere can exhaust atma's self confidence.
That was a lovely posting Unnatiji, well reasearched. Thanks, enjoyed thoroughly. _________________ Dasa nu das
Pushtidas |
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palna CEO
Joined: 04 Nov 2005 Posts: 241 Location: United Kingdom
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Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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Jai Shree Krishna,
Agreed Pushtidasji. Unnatiji, thanks I really enjoyed it! _________________ Prem Bandhan Ajab Gajab, Brahmaganth sami aa ganth, na tutai na chutai
Palna na Koti Koti Jai Shree Krishna |
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